Monday, March 23, 2009

Dancing Etiquette for Married Women

I got a multi-tiered question that in order to respond fully requires a post in itself.

The question was what was the proper etiquette for married women who want to dance but their husbands don't want to.

In general, albeit dancing is ensconced in a very general environment that would lead towards dating, dancing itself is not an action of flirting or romance. In other words it can be totally platonic and just a fun activity no different than playing volleyball. Of course it certainly has the potential to lead towards some kind of romance, but if Joe Schmoe asks Jane Schmoe at bar x to dance (ballroom) then yeah, they guy might have an interest, but he isn't proposing marriage.

This is arguably one of the largest complaints men have when women are sitting on the edge of their seats, bouncing up and down to a great salsa or swing band at the edge of the dance floor and then when somebody comes up and asks them to dance, they giggle and laugh and point at their friends and tell them "no, you dance with him!" "No! *giggle, giggle* YOU dance with him!"

It isn't a proposal of marriage.

It isn't a sexual proposition.

It isn't even asking if he could buy you a drink because that would cost money.

He's asking for a dance, so married or not, it's pretty safe.

Now that being said, I cannot think of a more adroit and classy way to meet a girl besides dancing. So naturally most men will approach dancing as primarily a means to have fun, but a close second to meet a girl.

This is where the married women have to do one simple thing;

Wear your wedding ring.

A slightly skilled dancer will even have the savvy to feel that large hunk of rock on your left hand, saving you the embarrassment of asking you out. So as long as you're married and have that ring, you're not going to run into any trouble, at least on the ballroom scene.

Now where married women run into trouble is when THEY TAKE OFF THE RING or play a game some female friends of mine called "Testing Our Market Value."

To simplify things (a lot) women want attention, men want sex. And whereas it's socially poo-pooed to go out and just ask for sex, to get attention is perfectly acceptable. This creates a conundrum, especially for married women who are not getting enough love or attention back at home. They some how feel the need to go out and doll themselves up and "test their market value" and get attention, ie- sit at a bar and see how many men buy them drinks as they're all dolled up and *oops* did they happen to "forget" to wear their wedding ring?

No doubt there are enough veteran males in my readership who could regale you with tales of going to a club/bar/party, meeting a really nice gal WITHOUT A RING and only after spending 4 hours getting to know this one girl, finding out she was married. This is not only deceitful, but it's disrespectful as the woman has not only led the guy on, but wasted his time which he might as otherwise used to meet an available (and might I add, more secure) woman.

This happens more often than you might think and to a severity of more than you might imagine.

The Captain had one experience where a drop dead gorgeous woman was dancing with him with long sleeve gloves (couldn't tell if she was married). I asked her if there was a ring under the gloves and she said yes - ergo "thanks for the dance, no harm done."

On the other extreme was the drop dead gorgeous redheaded economist he met in his dance class and dated for about 2 months. As you can imagine after two months, several dates, her having red hair AND being an economist, the young Captain was smitten. That was of course until we were salsa dancing late one night and whilst on the dance floor the poor ole Captain's hand got lacerated by huge chunk of diamond he hadn't noticed her wearing before. After changing his dance grip he had the shocking realization that she was married this entire time and just forgot to take her ring off.

Regardless the whole point is whether it's an hour or two months, don't be a tease. If you want to dance, go out and dance and wear your wedding ring. I find nothing wrong with dressing up a little fancy. But if you're going to slut yourself up and take off the ring and "test your market value" and lead a guy on so you can get your fill of attention-jollies at his expense, that's where women start to earn a bad reputation and make men long for the likes of Sophia Loren or Audrey Hepburn, or at least join the marriage strike.

20 comments:

Joie said...

awww, i am sorry to hear about your mishaps with the ladies.
just for the record i do always wear my ring when i go dancing, i find sometimes the men don't care and still persist as if i am not wearing a ring. then i just start in on my life with my children and my husband, and how much he loves me and makes sure i always have the opportunity to go dancing while he stays home and entertains the children. i usually lose them by that time. LOL!
most of the time the men repect that i am just there to dance, it is my outlet and exercise. so, i must say it does play both ways.

Anonymous said...

Thank you Captain!!

I always kind of belonged to the train of thought that a dance is just a dance, NOT foreplay. I really hated the idea that even though I love to dance, if a guy I don't know politely asks me to dance, I shouldn't because maybe he THINKS it means more.

Kind of like never eating ice cream on the off chance you are lactose intolerant.

Anyway, thanks again. Nice to know that there are guys like you out there, guys who will let women just enjoy dancing without trying to get "paid" for the chore.

Anonymous said...

Women do not eat babies.

Doug said...

Captain,

I have only made the mistake of not looking for a ring one time. Of course, that time was when I was at an event in a new city, and a friend was also at that event, and the music was just so darned good (good booze didn't help matters any).

Luckily, before I made a complete fool out of myself, one of my female friends said "You know she's married, right?"

Being the cool chemist that I am, I stated "Of course." Then, and only then, did I look at her hand and realize I had completely missed the fact that there was a huge freaking diamond on one of her fingers.

However, being a cool chemist I just kept dancing. She had always worn the ring, I was just too blinded to realize it.

She was a redhead, too. Go figure.

On the opposite side of the spectrum, I am now married, and my wife still likes to go out dancing. I used to teach in this town (Indy), so people know who I am, even if I don't go out much anymore. She always asks "Are you okay with me going out to the dance?"

My answer is always "Yes, because I taught most of the guys there to dance, so I know I'm still a better dancer than they are. Besides, I'm freaking awesome, and they can't measure up to my awesomeness."

That gets me a laugh and a kiss, and my wife goes out to have fun dancing while I stay at home and paint miniatures.

Thanks for the story, and thanks for reminding me of my crazy dancing days (and the redhead!).

Anonymous said...

Ladies,

the Captn is right the overwhelming majority of this time, but this time, his perception is skewed because of his love of dance. MOST of the time, we ARE trying to get you romantically involved by asking you to dance. Only rarely do men go out dancing (if ever?) for "fun." That being said, I totally agree, that if some guy has the nerve to ask you to dance, dance with him. If you find him repulsive, thank him afterward and go on your merry way.

Bike Bubba said...

One would figure that a man ought to wear his wedding ring as well if one is predisposed to dance without his wife....I'm not a big dancer, but...let's just say that when I hold my wife by the torso, well, non-platonic thoughts DO enter my mind. So I dance with her, and her alone.

How'd you get started teaching this? I notice you're at the local community center, and my wife has some special sewing skills that she might like to pass on to other area residents.

Anonymous said...

Nice post.

There's a married couple I'm good friends with, the husband loves to dance and when his wife gets tired of dancing, he and I'll go on the dance floor and have a good time dancing together while his wife will take a break for 15 or 20 minutes.

The husband's happy because he still has someone to dance with, the wife is happy because she gets to catch her breath, and I'm happy because the husband is a good friend and a fun dance partner. We all have a great time and no harm done.

Tellingly, that couple is in their 50s. While they have no problem with the concept of a platonic good time with a member of the opposite sex, most guys who are around my age (I'm 34) seem to be of the opinion that if a girl either offers or accepts an offer to dance, then she must have something more in mind than just a dance. While I won't argue with Anonymous 832 that a lot of guys ARE hoping there's something more in store, I've also known a lot of guys who really would like it to be JUST a dance and some pleasant company without having to deal with a woman who's suddenly started worrying about which wedding dress she'll buy and which church they'll get married in, just because a guy asked her to dance with him.

And the Captain is also right about the women who like the play the game of testing their market value. It's a son-of-a-bitch to deal with. While I feel bad for the guys like him who have gotten burned by it, I also feel bad for the girls like me who keep running into guys who have gotten burned and are now suspicious of and cynical about ALL women.

And it really makes me angry when a lot of these women will go right up to the edge of having an affair, but will turn around and feel completely justified and have no guilt at all about what they did because they were feeling lonely or were "having a bad day" (never mind that if their husband dealt with his "bad days" like that it would be a whole different story).

So thank you for the dancing etiquette lesson and thank you also for calling out women who play that game as the insecure trouble-makers that they are.

wormlynn said...

I completly agree, and I thankfully have never been [part of the "normal" crowd and have all ways said yes, even in high school to those men (boys) who where brave enough to ask me to dance! I was all ways wanting to dance so bad and usually would only dance with my girlfriends. Then I became an adult and danced every Thursday night at the Loring Pasta Bar, I loved it! Most of the men there understood we where all there for fun, and because I danced with them I didnt want to jump into bed with them. It was wonderful. And now I have a wonderful husband who took lessons with me by yours truly and we are secure in our selves and our love enough to dance with other people if asked and even to ask other people. Its great and more people need to be like this.

Anonymous said...

Ah, the married woman who shows up at a dance alone. Yes, tread with care as if you were in a mine field because all the good excuses are on her side. For a guy, the best way to play it is to just dance. After all, being seen with an attractive lady who can match you step for step will perhaps spark the fancy of another, hopefully not married, woman, so the game doesn't need to be a zero-sum game. A single guy and a married woman can each get something out of the dance.

Anonymous said...

What annoys me the most is when a married woman responds to a request to dance with "I'm sorry, I'm married."

Now dance clubs are normally loud, so when I get that reply I'm kind of confused. Did she think I said "I want to date you?" So I clarify "No I was asking if you wanted to salsa."

"I can't sorry, I'm married."

It's pretty rare but should I assume that dancing in some cultures is considered forbidden if married? Because that's pretty assumptive on my intent (i just want to dance not date) which I dislike.

Anonymous said...

I think there is no right or wrong answer. Clubs are full of many different people looking for different things. Granted ... the majority of guys who dance in clubs are looking/hoping to get lucky. It is true that many married women do get dolled up and go to clubs purposely looking for attention but say they are just going out for fun ... that they like to dance etc. Many will not admit this, even to themselves. On the other hand, there are many individuals who are honest, respectful and just want to have a good evening with dance and fun.

I feel that those who snub anyone in this case, for feeling jealous etc., are ignorant. It is part of being human and caring ... the degree of which may be problematic, but it is no body's business (like in this forum) to put another down for having feelings of jealousy (husbands that is). "Everybody" can be jealous to some degree ...it is natural as joy.

I have witnessed first hand women telling their husbands they were "only dancing" ... that nothing out of the ordinary happened on any given evening when clearly much more than "nothing" went on. Many women, especially after several drinks, will allow a stranger to do much more than what is acceptable. Anyone who denies that this happens has never been to a big dance club and watched with eyes wide open.

This is exactly what the insecure/jealous guy at home fears and it certainly does occur. Not saying every married women (or man) behaves this way in a dance club, but it does happen more than most realize or are "willing" to admit. It is not even that the people who do behave this way don't love their significant other; it comes down to a matter of respect and honesty ... with your spouse and yourself. Unfortunately, some are willing to throw this under the rug to go out and have fun.

Many people are willing to lie, to themselves and think they are not doing wrong etc. and have somehow come to believe that behaving this way is harmless. Any issues of jealousy/lack of trust and the truth of what actually goes during "lady's/men’s night out" should be discussed, with the help of a third party if necessary. This kind of behaviour is the kind of spark that can lead to much bigger problems or fuel other issues.

Issues like this should be worked out one way or another ... the old "what they don't know won't hurt them" attitude is not “right” any way you look at it ... no one should be forced to accept anything or be kept in the dark. That old saying of “what comes around goes around” exists for a reason. I do believe that for the most part the vast majority of married women are not running out and having sex etc. but I do believe that sometimes much more than what is relayed to the husband goes on.

Dancing by nature is sexual/erotic/ sensual and anyone who denies that.... well I’ve got some swamp land ... When women get dressed up and are in the mood for fun, things can and sometimes do happen and what woman ever wants to be 100% honest and burst their fun bubble? Often if someone is so hesitant to tell another the truth is it because they themselves know that what has transgressed is not acceptable ... or maybe to themselves but not their significant other. Living a lie is not good ... especially if one is doing so simply for the sake of personal enjoyment/entertainment.

Anonymous said...

Hopefully this thread is still alive and well...perhaps not well at all. I've been married 21 years and 1-1/2 years ago my wife started the going out to dance with friend routine. It has lead to numerous problems and at the brink of marrigae and family, we have two teenage children. Short story...trust and communication are the only cure. Forcing your beliefs onto another won't work. If your spouse is going to cheat they will be it at the club or elsewhere. For those 40 ish women, also look carefully at mid life issues, change or life etc etc. I've come to the point that my "ego" will take a break...her going out to dance isn't going to kill the marriage or family. Having our time is also very important....don't let that one act taint the entire relationship.

Unknown said...

I'm married and recently went dancing with my ring (though it's a band and not a rock). Anyway I had lots of men asking me to dance and it was wonderful and definitely something I can't wait to do again. However, I found it a little tricky to deal with the guys who tried to push the limits of respectable dancing. I liked it but felt guilty after for liking it.

becuzicare said...

My husband and I recently attended a music festival and happened to be that my grandfather sat between us. The man next to me and myself we are expressing our love for bluegrass and clogging, he asked me did I want a clog, I brushed it off and didn't say anything but I really wanted to call so I said sure and we got up and clogged my husband was acting funny and when we got home he was angry because I got up with a man and dance and didn't ask his permission he made me feel like I did something very shameful almost sinful, I felt so bad I didn't even know what to say so finally I said I'm so sorry please forgive me but I did not feel like I did anything wrong!

becuzicare said...

My husband and I and my grandfather were at a music festival, my grandfather had sat in between my husband and I, the man next to me and myself were talking about how we like bluegrass and clogging, my husband doesn't like to dance but I do, well I was surprised when the man next to me asked me did I want to clog, I didn't say anything and after a few minutes I said sure, my husband was acting funny after that and when we got home he said do you need to tell me something? I didn't know what to say so I said what do I need to tell you, he was upset that I danced with the man and didn't ask his permission, it made me feel very shameful and almost sinful but I didn't feel like I had done anything wrong but I apologized and said I was sorry and ask for forgiveness

Servant of God said...

I don't like if my wife wants to dance with another male because it involves skin to skin touching and hugging . She also doesn't like me dancing with another woman for the same reason . That's why we only dance in the bed .
But I don't have problems with her seeing a male doctor provided she's accompanied with female nurses .

Unknown said...

If your husband dont care then no problem. If it's a problem with him then don't do it. If you are ya own woman and dont care what he feels then be ready for the problems that come with it.. me personally I wouldn't want my wife dancing with another man at all. I don't want another man touching on my wife and sh** and she shouldn't either and if she did then we have a problem there too

Unknown said...

Smh you should feel guilty you let other men touch all on you dance is an expression of love so yea you should

momus1 said...

My significent other went to a swimg dance class without me, and afterwards gleefully told me how tired she was from dancing so much and bragged about all the compliments sbe got. For me, this is something I can live without, and I am not sure that I want this person in my life. I am angry, my feelings are hurt, and more.

Anonymous said...

Damn straight Bently! Tell it like it is!